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Thursday, January 03, 2008
I guess Florida's oranges never heard of Al Gore
The global warming debate is over.
The earth is getting warmer.
Pay no attention to those Florida farmers desperately trying to save their crops from freezing.
Nothing to see, here. Move along.
Posted by D.J. McGuire on January 3, 2008 in International Politics, Science | Permalink
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Believing that this story proves anything about whether or not global warming is happening is like believing that the Los Angeles Kings are the best team in the NHL because they have won their last three games in a row. Die hard Kings fans might believe that the team has truly turned the corner and are now going to march to Stanley Cup victory, but everyone else knows that this is a brief aberration. Global warming deniers are just as deluded (and rare) as die hard LA Kings fans, as this post proves.
Whatcha gonna do for your next trick? Point to a stopped clock twice each day and insist that it still works fine? How clever!
Posted by: Fact Check | 2008-01-03 8:09:27 AM
Expect this kind of response from leftoid doomsayers everytime HARD EVIDENCE is presented that rebuffs their huff and puff HYPOTHESIS.
Epsi
Posted by: Epsilon | 2008-01-03 8:15:35 AM
Epsi: "Expect this kind of response from leftoid doomsayers everytime HARD EVIDENCE is presented that rebuffs their huff and puff HYPOTHESIS."
I presume you are talking about the three-game winning streak as evidence of the LA Kings' superiority, right?
Posted by: Fact Check | 2008-01-03 8:27:13 AM
There are freezes every year in Florida. They prove nothing pro or con about global warming. (Or Gorebull Warming as some of us call it.)
But anyone paying attention to this issue can see the wheels started to loosen and wobble on the global warming alarmist bandwagon.
Just recently you had more than 100 prominent earth scientists issue a press release at the recent Bali-Hoo giving the reasons they disagree with the hypothesis of human-caused warming. Several of these sicentists had been members of the IPCC panel so they, in effect, have broken ranks. The main stream media, of course, ignored the story.
Now, we have an article in the journal Nature stating that the 2007 Arctic ice loss, cited by the Chicken Little crowd as proof of disasters to come, was due to natural, cyclical causes. This article reinforces what less excitable people had been saying about Arctic climate, namely that multi-decadal weather oscillations bring warming and cooling cycles to the Arctic. The Arctic was as warm or warmer in the 1930s than it is now but we didn't have any satellite photos back then to get all worked up about.
How come the main stream media, which took such joy in showing us the Arctic ice loss in the summer of 2007 didn't report that during that same period, which is the southern hemisphere winter, there was more ice around the Antarctic regions than had been seen in decades. They also don't tell us that the Antarctic ice sheet has been thickening for about 50 years now and that the southern hemisphere has been cooling for some time.
It's supposed to be GLOBAL warming, isn't it?[;
Posted by: JMD | 2008-01-03 8:29:43 AM
Well it is 27F here this morning in Alabama. I actually had to turn on the heat! No snow, however, which is not unusual for these parts.
Maybe, just maybe that erratic weather neither proves nor disproves the existence of global warming.
All the science in the world can't make Kyoto a workable solution for climate change. It is a tax scam, pure and simple.
Posted by: Zebulon Pike | 2008-01-03 8:40:02 AM
"Global warming deniers are just as deluded (and rare) as die hard LA Kings fans, as this post proves."
So now the people who don't believe in this wild scam, despite much of the science, and most of all good old common sense, are the deluded ones?
And you call yourself "fact check"?
Here's a news flash for you fat chick, I'm one of this nasty old "deniers", I cut a pretty wide swath, and I don't know anyone who believes in man made global warming.
The reason lefties like you are a dying breed is for reasons like this, shrieking at normal people, calling them names and telling them the world is going to end is growing old bubba.
All your propaganda and spin doesn't work in the real world where people from cold climates are suffering from, guess what, cold, always have, and the same old problems, like frost in Florida continues to happen.
You are the one who looks like an idiot fat chick, not clear thinking people in this world.
Posted by: deepblue | 2008-01-03 8:40:25 AM
Tonight on the CBC National Peter Mansbridge stated that "there is evidence (and more to follow) that man made global warming may not be the only reason that ice is melting in the Arctic. Studies now show that it is a natural phenomenon that is cyclical in nature." He did go on to mention this phenomenon is in conjunction with made-made causes, didn't mention the percentage of contribution from either source.
More here http://tinyurl.com/37j3ch
Posted by: John West | 2008-01-03 9:05:05 AM
A good source of information about global warming can be found at friendsofscience.org. Check it out, Fact Check. You'll find some challenges to your view of things. Global warming is not a fact. Regional warming is a fact - as is regional cooling. The overall situation is a lot more complex than scare-mongering politicos think.
Posted by: Ras Erasmus | 2008-01-03 9:05:59 AM
Every few years frosts hit the citrus crops in Florida, that's why they own smudge pots and employ helicopters to keep the night air in motion. There's nothing new or startling about this cold snap just as there is nothing new or startling about the myths surrounding globull warming.
It's called the weather.
Posted by: atric | 2008-01-03 9:06:38 AM
I agree with atric.
Can anyone come up with a list of months that these frost occurrences usually happen in?
Posted by: Speller | 2008-01-03 10:30:07 AM
Weather variations such as these are well within the natural variation of historical trends and contribute nothing to either side of the "debate". But it is somewhat entertaining to throw it back at the humourless sky-is-falling crowd (who use every trivial warming blip as "proof") for squirm-factor.
Posted by: John Chittick | 2008-01-03 11:10:37 AM
Fact Check: "Believing that this story proves anything about whether or not global warming is happening is like believing that the Los Angeles Kings are the best team in the NHL because they have won their last three games in a row."
Epsilon: "Expect this kind of response from leftoid doomsayers everytime HARD EVIDENCE is presented that rebuffs their huff and puff HYPOTHESIS."
JMD: "There are freezes every year in Florida. They prove nothing pro or con about global warming."
Epsilon: "leftoid doomsayer!"
Zebulon Pike: "Maybe, just maybe that erratic weather neither proves nor disproves the existence of global warming."
Epsilon: "leftoid doomsayer!"
deepblue: "the same old problems, like frost in Florida continues to happen."
Epsilon: "leftoid doomsayer!"
atric: "There's nothing new or startling about this cold snap"
Epsilon: "leftoid doomsayer!"
Speller: "I agree with atric."
Epsilon: "leftoid doomsayer!"
deepblue: "The reason lefties like you are a dying breed is for reasons like this, shrieking at normal people, calling them names."
John Chittick: "Weather variations such as these are well within the natural variation of historical trends and contribute nothing to either side of the 'debate'."
Epsilon: "leftoid!"
deepblue: "lefty! namecaller!"
Epsilon: "doomsayer!"
Posted by: Fact Check | 2008-01-03 11:21:18 AM
Leftoid doomsayers like Fact Check resort to these kinds of posts when they are unable to respond to the fundamental fact that their arguments are nothing but "hot air".
May I suggest, Fact Check, that you send Al Gore a fat check to compensate for the amount of hot air you are blowing right now!
Epsi
Posted by: Epsilon | 2008-01-03 12:06:44 PM
Fat Chick,
Yawn.
Posted by: deepblue | 2008-01-03 12:54:43 PM
Fact Check, if in fact you're interested in checking facts, try this link out.
It's an excellent read on a 23 part series known as the "Deniers". All 23 links are listed within the article and is a must read for those on both sides of the argument.
If you have an open mind you may be surprised at what you read. If you want to remain a drone screaming "the world is melting!", well that's a shame.
http://www.financialpost.com/story.html?id=c47c1209-233b-412c-b6d1-5c755457a8af
Posted by: Niv | 2008-01-03 1:57:58 PM
The climate change enthusiasts push the science in order to force people to accept Kyoto. Fortunately, Kyoto is such a deeply flawed idea that common sense convinced people to resist them. Bless them for it.
Posted by: Zebulon Pike | 2008-01-03 2:23:25 PM
I miss OBC and his cutting and pithy comments.
Posted by: atric | 2008-01-03 3:32:03 PM
Fact Check: “Believing that this story proves anything about whether or not global warming is happening is like believing that the Los Angeles Kings are the best team in the NHL because they have won their last three games in a row. Die hard Kings fans might believe that the team has truly turned the corner and are now going to march to Stanley Cup victory, but everyone else knows that this is a brief aberration. Global warming deniers are just as deluded (and rare) as die hard LA Kings fans, as this post proves.
Whatcha gonna do for your next trick? Point to a stopped clock twice each day and insist that it still works fine? How clever!”
Your posts would be more believable, Fact Check, if both your words and your screen name were not so overflowing with adolescent petulance. Getting in someone’s face, flicking them in the love spuds with a wet towel and peeing in their punch isn’t the same as saying something significant, and anyone of sense knows it.
Of COURSE global warming is happening; it’s been happening for the last ten thousand years. Otherwise we’d still be under a mile-thick ice sheet. Moreover, it was actually warmer about 5,000 years ago than it is today. Temperatures declined somewhat, but were still an average of about 1 degree Celsius higher in the time of Christ and two degrees higher around 1100 A.D., which is why the Vikings were able to colonize Greenland—at that time it was virtually ice-free. The world then entered what was known as the “Little Ice Age,” from which it is likely still recovering.
Sure the world’s going to look warmer today than it did in 1616, when they had “frost fairs” on the Thames, which froze solid (as did likely the Fraser, which is at the same latitude). Even as late as 1843 you can read the description of a London winter in Charles Dickens’s “A Christmas Carol,” and realize it doesn’t sound at all like a typical London winter today. The point is the world has ALREADY been warmer than what the climate-change “Repent Ye” crowd says is the point of no return, and comfortably within recorded history. Climate has and will continue to yo-yo throughout history, for reasons that are still poorly understood.
So until we DO understand, why don’t you just can the studied arrogance, the superior snottiness, the pretend Ph.D. Nothing is so freakish and pathetic as a doomsday prophet crying out, “Hey, who are you gonna believe—your eyes, or me?” The only reason these death-and-doom merchants aren’t begging for money in the streets is because the government already gives it to them.
Posted by: Shane Matthews | 2008-01-03 4:48:55 PM
Well done, Shane. The Gorebull Warmists prattle on about deniers being funded by Big Oil. However any money anyone in that camp has ever received from industry is a pittance compared to what governments lavish on scientists and researchers who drink Al Gore's Kool-Aid.
Posted by: JMD | 2008-01-04 6:49:50 AM
Al Gore may be supping on his own Kool-Aid the way things are shaping up.
Posted by: Liz J | 2008-01-04 1:57:06 PM
Here's an interesting global cooling prediction from a scientist, admittedly, from the same country that produced "Lysenko". Not news to me but what is becoming much more mainstream, logical, and where I would put my money.
http://en.rian.ru/analysis/20080103/94768732.html
Posted by: John Chittick | 2008-01-04 3:07:19 PM
Know why there's no ice sheet a mile thick on the prairies? Climate change. Know why there WAS an ice sheet a mile thick on the prairies? Climate change.
Fact Check is right about one thing, and one thing only, as far as I can tell. A cold spell in Florida does not disprove the theory of AGW. Climate change occurs over a period of decades, centuries, and millenia.
The point is that it always occurs. Always. Since the Earth cooled into a solid.
The discussion about whether AGW is actually occurring or not is a valid one. An actual scientist will not use terms like "denier"; "skeptic," perhaps, but not "denier."
Climate change is the new religion of the Left. Nothing more.
Posted by: Darrell | 2008-01-04 6:33:00 PM
Fact Check-
Your point is, extrapolation from two points that are close together is inaccurate. That is a valid point. This old surveyor can assure you that extrapolation is the most inaccurate system of measurement.
The problem is, you've overlooked the fact that the whole theory of man-made global warming is built around extrapolation. Entirely. They have no other reference to tie to.
You can't base your entire argument on one system of measurement, then criticize the other side for using the exact same method, can you?
Posted by: dp | 2008-01-04 6:43:04 PM
dp:
It's curious that science demands proof for its explorations and discoveries.
Pure science deals with coming to an understanding about things which already exist.
Extrapolations and theories of future events have another name ... science fiction.
That's where I would categorize the theory of man-made global warming.
Posted by: set you free | 2008-01-04 6:52:39 PM
These next 2 paragraphs from a recent New York Times article. When an article like this appears in the very leftist NY Times, onew cannot help but wonder if even the left is starting to come to terms with the facts.
“Many people concerned about climate change,” Dr. Sunstein says, “want to create an availability cascade by fixing an incident in people’s minds. Hurricane Katrina is just an early example; there will be others. I don’t doubt that climate change is real and that it presents a serious threat, but there’s a danger that any ‘consensus’ on particular events or specific findings is, in part, a cascade.”
Once a cascade is under way, it becomes tough to sort out risks because experts become reluctant to dispute the popular wisdom, and are ignored if they do. Now that the melting Arctic has become the symbol of global warming, there’s not much interest in hearing other explanations of why the ice is melting — or why the globe’s other pole isn’t melting, too.
Full story here:
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/01/01/science/01tier.html?_r=4&ref=science&oref=slogin&oref=slogin&oref=slogin&oref=slogin
Posted by: Brent Weston | 2008-01-04 7:01:06 PM
"Al Gore may be supping on his own Kool-Aid the way things are shaping up."
Maybe, but with over $100 million in his bank account already from this scam, there will be no problem paying the bill. :)
Posted by: obc | 2008-01-04 8:46:25 PM
"Al Gore may be supping on his own Kool-Aid the way things are shaping up."
Maybe, but with over $100 million in his bank account already from this scam, there will be no problem paying the bill. :)
Posted by: obc | 2008-01-04 8:47:45 PM
If mankind is capable of controlling the rise of the temperature of earth's climate that by inference says that they can cause a decline of earth's temperature. The global warming alarmists have frequently said that change initiated now will not take affect for anumber of years. What if those with their hands on the throttle miscalculate and their actions result in catastrophic cooling. Are the great thinkers, ahem, Al Gore, and his ilk prepared for that eventuality? Personally I think earth is far better equipped to undergo global warming with fewer bad effects on the world population than would happen with global cooling.
Posted by: Bob Wood | 2008-01-05 2:56:17 PM
Poster:
You're talking apples & oranges. :)
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,320431,00.html
Posted by: obc | 2008-01-05 3:32:51 PM
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