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Saturday, October 14, 2006

Alberta's moment

In a piece in The Globe and Mail on October 4th, "A Little Friendly Talk About Alberta Separatism," Gordon Gibson observed the key difference between the Alberta separatism of the 1980s and of the 2001s:

This is quite a change from the Alberta separatism of a couple of decades ago. The speech and the dialogue was quiet and reasoned, no firebrand stuff. Prof. Craig said that this was his first and last political appearance, and anyway hard-core separatism in Alberta was probably only 10 per cent. But he may have started something. Quiet and reasoned talk is especially dangerous.

No longer is separatism something confined to the looney fringe.  It's in the corporate boardrooms of the senior oil patch.

For all that, while today's Alberta separatism carries a veneer of sweet reasonableness and wears better suits, I believe the separatists of the 1980s had far more substantive reasons for pursuing separatism than their ideological confreres of the 2001s.

Consider:  in the early 1980s, Alberta had about half the population it does, now, and not nearly the political or economic clout it now enjoys.  Alberta and B.C. can now claim a population virtually equal to Quebec's, and it's just a matter of time -- maybe a decade -- till these two provinces can claim as many seats in the House of Commons as Quebec's guaranteed 75.

"Ah," you are thinking, "but what about Ontario?"

Thought you'd never ask . . . Add Saskatchewan and Manitoba's guaranteed seat count of 14 each to Alberta and B.C.'s aggregate, and it is close to equalling Ontario's.  It shouldn't be lost on Albertans that today's Government of Ontario is not your father's Oldsmobile.  Today's Ontario is far less willing to play the pro-Ottawa role it espoused through much of the 20th century.  Today's Ontario carries fiscal chips on its shoulder about how much tax revenue Ottawa collects from the Great Lakes and how little comes back to, er, Upper Canada.

There are strategic alliances to be made in the West, to be sure.  But there's an even more important alliance to be struck between Canada's "have-est" provinces, Alberta and Ontario.

Quebec shouldn't be counted out, either.  Historically, two provinces have complained the most about the federal government's intrusions into key, provincial jurisdictions:  Quebec and (yup!) Alberta.  Issue by issue, there are alliances to be formalized, here, too.

As for the Atlantic provinces, Premier Klein is on record more than once as supporting Newfoundland and Nova Scotia's concerns in respect of their growing revenues and development in the Atlantic oil patch.

Alberta is positioned as at no time in the history of the Dominion to set the agenda for the entire Canadian Union.  Alberta need no longer only aspire to Confederation leadership.  Alberta can exercise leadership and make its influence felt across the country . . . including on Parliament Hill and on Bay Street.  So . . . get on with it.

Alberta's moment has arrived.

Posted by Russ Kuykendall on October 14, 2006 in Canadian Politics, Canadian Provincial Politics | Permalink

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Comments

Since we have lost our national identity and with it pride in our heritage roots, the tie that binds is no longer an issue. Our confederation union is in sad state of repair. Its time to seriously address and resolve the issues that divide us or else let us go in peace..

Posted by: Frico | 2006-10-14 9:16:22 PM


I agree with many of the sentiments in this essay, but have one reservation.

Ontario will never change. They may have fewer seats than before, but their political culture refuses to accept their decline. They could have no seats yet they will act as if they owned Parliament.

Moreover, decades of anti-Alberta racism will make the idea of Alberta setting the national agenda completely impalatable to Ontario. They're so used to being in charge that the idea of subordination is shameful. When, not if, Ontario regains control via the Liebral/NDP party, they will make Alberta pay for disrespecting Ontario's interests - in other words, a second NEP through Kyoto. When that happens, Alberta will have no option but to secede.

The old saying is true: a leopard can't change its spots. I guess we'll have to shoot the old cat.

Posted by: Zebulon Pike | 2006-10-15 12:04:03 AM


Agreed - Alberta's time has come. How many people in Alberta truly recognize this and further more, believe it.

Albertans have a very unique opportunity right now to have their vote count for the next premier of Alberta (at least for the next two years or until the next provincial election).

If eligible voters fail to exercise their single vote, they may wake up next month to realize how "power interest groups" have influenced the outcome by block voting - not by voting for what is good for the province but for what is good for their particular group.

The proof in the pudding will be just how many eligible voters buy a Conservative membership for $5 and actually turn our to cast their vote at the provincial Conservative leadership next month. This is about every eligible voter in the province regardless of political party loyalties right now - not just about the Conservative party of Alberta.

Yes, the stakes are becoming very high. Yet, there has been very little "chatter" about just who these candidates are and what they are about - most of it in the press has been about what the candidates themselves choose to talk about or put on their web site.

How o.k. is it to have a premier of Alberta who holds a dual citizenship? More interesting is just how many eligible voters are even aware that this might be a possibility.

What do the candidates know about Law S-3? Further, who among the eligible voters know anything about this law. I have to wonder just how much the press even knows of this law and its ramifications for Alberta.

This leadership race is not just about those who have traditionally supported the Conservative party with pretty low turnouts at the polls over the years and have been content to see a "hand off" from one Conservative leader to another who feels "entitled" to receive the hand off.

Far to many eligible voters in Alberta have come to believe that it is really quite useless to vote in a Provincial election - we all know that the conservatives are going to win and will likely continue to do so; so why bother to even vote - and far to many do not. The upcoming election of the new Alberta premeier is huge - and yes, every individual vote is going to count for something.

I have my doubts that a whole lot of eligible voters even realize that this is a "one person- one vote" opportunity to vote for the Premier of Alberta. This may never happen again for a good long time. It is totally unlike the "delegate voting" system where an individual vote is often lost to the "power players" within a particular political party. Time will tell.

Posted by: calgary clipper | 2006-10-15 4:00:42 AM


It was in Ontario’s interest not to see Quebec separate. So, Ontario indirectly appeased Quebec for decades by voting for Liberals that bought off Quebec. Adscam made it clear that corrupt formula was not a good idea. Moreover, Ontario now realizes that Quebec isn’t going to separate. It can’t, it has $120 billion in debt and a serious demographic problem. It’s in population decline and aging baby boomers are going to cost their social system more than it can bear.

The only risk is that Quebecers are even more badly informed by their MSM than the ROC. Recent pro-Hezbo and anti-Isreal events are are a good example and Iggy fell into the trap.

Ordinary Quebecers have been mislead by thier leaders and MSM for decades, they actually think Confederation costs them. Harper is working with Charest for a sensible more permanent solution. Ontario will now trust Harper with the Quebec file more than they will trust Liberals … this is a sea change.

Will Ontario now appease Alberta? You bet. Because Alberta can easily afford to separate.

I think Harper knows how to play this poker game. Ontario is starting to figure out that putting Harper in a majority situation is its best chance to avoid the country from breaking up. This is going to be a lot more fun to watch than reality TV.


Posted by: nomdenet | 2006-10-15 7:25:09 AM


The fact Ralph Klein said Ted Morton would be too extreme makes him a compelling candidate for leadership.

Ralphie has never had the inclination to seize back provincial jurisdictions from the Ottawa centrists inspired by Chairman Trudeau and his idols in Paris.

Quebec has exercised its constitutional rights but, without confiscation of Alberta's wealth by the Ontario centrises, is well on the way to becoming an economic basket-case.

It's like the Saskatchewan of the east. Great people with no clue as to how to set up a future of their own children ... and with no clue that by looking after their own selfish interests by not having children, they have doomed themselves to a miserable age of decline.

Posted by: Set you free | 2006-10-15 8:39:23 AM


That should read ... Ontario centrists.

Posted by: Set you free | 2006-10-15 8:40:32 AM


"Alberta's moment has arrived."

LOL!!! Now do us all a favour and put down the hand lotion and search for the box of Kleenex, ok?

Posted by: Mark Logan | 2006-10-15 8:52:04 AM


kleenax for tears of JOY

Posted by: Frico | 2006-10-15 9:34:15 AM


Unfortunately there is no change in the seat numbers game that could give lasting benefits to the West. The ELB's {eastern liberal bastards} plus quebec still hold the balance of power. Harper makes me feel good to be a Western Canadian again and I support him fully but the numbers are against us in the long run.

I think Quebec could be the catalyst for Western Separation. Financially supporting the PQ alone would send a powerful message to any quebecer sitting on the separation fence. They are so touchy feely about everything can’t you just imagine how their “distinct society” would react if parts of Canada were actively campaigning to get rid of them? I say help them get lost. Should Quebec succeed in their separation vote you have just changed the numbers game dramatically. What effect would a large PLEASE LEAVE campaign have on Quebec voters in the final days of their Provincial election with no time to react? With quebec on the way out the gates are now open.


Posted by: Western Canadian | 2006-10-15 9:45:53 AM


"For all that, while today's Alberta separatism carries a veneer of sweet reasonableness and wears better suits, I believe the separatists of the 1980s had far more substantive reasons for pursuing separatism than their ideological confreres of the 2001s.

Consider: in the early 1980s, Alberta had about half the population it does, now, and not nearly the political or economic clout it now enjoys."
Thus Spake Russ the Ontarian.

Every reason I had in the 1980s still exists. Does Alberta have twice the number of Parliamentry seats that she had in the 1980s? No.

Is the ROC letting Alberta have 100% of her energy revenue? No.

Are there any gaurantees that Alberta's non-renewable resources will be raided again? No.

Does Ontario still dictate how Albertan's can live in Alberta from 2500 miles away? Yes.

Have Ontarian's demonstrated that they find Liberal corruption repugnant? No.

The Kyoto scam is just NEP 2.
Oh, and hardcore Alberta Nationalism is a lot higher than 10%.

Posted by: Speller | 2006-10-15 9:47:41 AM



"Quebec has exercised its constitutional rights but, without confiscation of Alberta's wealth by the Ontario centrises, is well on the way to becoming an economic basket-case.

It's like the Saskatchewan of the east. Great people with no clue as to how to set up a future of their own children ... and with no clue that by looking after their own selfish interests by not having children, they have doomed themselves to a miserable age of decline."
===========================================

I might suggest that these two provinces are the most socialistic in the country. More even than BC that is only big dipper in and around Vancouver and the Island areas. Otherwise it's same as Alberta here.

Socialism is a poltical system and a mindset that begins the eat the host from day one and continues to eat until there is nothing left ... just like it has in all the countries that embrace it. Examples of socialist success can be found in Cuba and North Korea .. there are many others, I am sure you can name one or two.

watch the future collapse of socialist France and Germany and Spain ... England might go too since the dippers have made that country a virutal Looney Bin of political correctness and appeasment to the death cult muslims who infest it's major cities.

Socialism is suicide in Slo-mo ... always has been always will be.

It's the child living off of a parent and never learning to get on it's own ... the parent is the entrepreneur, the risk taker, the doers in our world ... They flee socialist states like birds on a branch in Autumn. Then, The socialist child slowly starves while eating what's left of it's own.

Socialism is exactly like cancer!

Just thought I would toss in these thoughts in support of the free enterprize spirit of Alberta and it's hearty people.

Posted by: Duke | 2006-10-15 10:54:57 AM


Political ties between Ontario and Alberta? What is this some western socialist's wet dream?

Wake up!

As Alberta and BC become wealth engines, the central banking/political cartels will cut deals with provincial leaders to slowly sell that wealth out by exporting back east and continuing to allow the jurisdictional raiding of a greedy central tax grabbing cabal to continue.

More seats for Alberta to match Quebec and sit as an equal in Parliament?....stop it...you'll go blind!

Posted by: Wlyonmackenzie | 2006-10-15 11:18:49 AM


Why do we Albertans continue to tease ourselves with the thought of separation? There has always been a lot of talk and bravado but never a serious well articulated movement. I concur with above that there is much more than 10% of the populace that is hard core separatist. I also concur that the crowd daring to consider separation are educated leaders of industry. I've sat in on many board room discussions about this subject. The idea of redneck homeland is the image projected by liberal elitists in the East is simply the result of their starved imaginations. Though many of you Albertans have hope in PM Harper, I do not (though I like the man and support him) my "prophecy" is this: Mr. Harper will lose the next election despite his wonderful advances in Ottawa, he will be characterized as out of touch with "Canadian values" (a.k.a Liberal values), the east will fear the loss of a strong central Government in Ottawa if under an Albertan's leadership, Kyoto (which is the NEP in environmentalist drag) will be implemented and Alberta's wealth will be "shared" with the people who need it; those in the east with there socialist ideas of universal daycare etc. This despite the fact that even under PM Harper the gov't is too centralized and strong exercising its harsh will upon the people of all provinces and regions. We Albertans will continue to complain about Ottawa and our need to separate ad infinitum ad nausium. Our best interim hope is Ted Morton. Separate police force (meaning not the liberal storm trooper arm like the RCMP), separate social safety net, separate immigration plan and policy, and separate taxation. Sounds sooooo good! If we need to separate we only need 33% like the USA did when seeking independence. This generation of Albertans will go down in history as impotent and fearful if we lose our connections to the east. We are a pathetic lot! We need a person that can set the vision, carry out the agenda and articulate our cause thus bringing what we need. Independece from Ottawa.

Posted by: "Biff" Henderson | 2006-10-15 11:35:17 AM


IMO, the key to the future of this nation is centered in the provinces of Alberta and British Columbia. If Alberta chooses Ted Morton to run the local show, British Columbia will wake up; so will Sask. and the Yukon. Sask and the Yukon have been living off the other provinces for years now; the Yukon in luxury, Sask less so because Sask. still has some sturdy stock who work for a living and produce something thus can be overtaxed. The Yukon produces nothing but The Yukon people just elected a Conservative government so the $$$ would keep flowing to gov't paper shufflers (almost all DPs from the east and Sask - entreprenarial Yukoners left back in the 1980's and there are only 30 thousand souls here), the thought was that a Liberan$$ or Dipper victory would not give the paper minions any barganing chips with the Feds (the Liberal MP had a pretty cozy relationship with the Conservative Premier and Larry Bagnel was a member of the Privy council - the money just rolled in and nobody did anything ) I call this 'stratigic voting' - Bagnell won the last Fed election in a landslide. This is 'juvinille mindset' in it's most basic form but the idea to be on the same side as the Feds is still there. It is up to the people of the provinces to make sure that the resources they own benifit the people who LIVE in the province. I think Ted Morton will make sure that Alta. does not pay for paper shufflers all over Canada, in Conservative jurisdictions, by robbing Alta via the Federal Government.
Stephen Harper was up here in Aug and he told the Yukon people that it was up to this territory to get off the payolla from the ROC - we have lots of resources but the environmentalists and treaty claims have the territory locked up. Alberta has a lot to loose if the people choose the wrong Premier and it will not ever be the fault of PMSH.

Posted by: jema54j | 2006-10-15 11:50:55 AM


I would invite some people to use what we call paragraphs for ease of comprehension.

Let me ask a question. If all the entities in the Canadian federation were independent rather than part of the federation, would they be interested in building a federation together?

I suggest this should be seriously considered. Use computers to try to answer the question. Haven't we seen the European federation being built since WWII?

Japan is a physically small country but one of the strongest economy in the world. USA is a definite success as a federation. Switzerland is quite a success.

Do the people of Alberta ever considered that oil might not be such a great resource in a few years?

What if fossil fuels were to be replaced by another source of energy without pollution and much more efficient? I hope this will happen not to hurt Alberta economy but to stop money from flowing into terrorism by oil states like the ones in middle east. And even Venezuela is helping our enemies.

I would like to see more westerners moving in Québec. That would help curtail this sickening attitude of social welfare doom. I believe there are many Christians in Alberta. I invite a large number of them to move in Québec.

I believe Canada is still a country in the making. Let's become creative in order to build a great country. We have the space. Do we have the will to do it?

Abraham Lincoln said:
If you think that education is costly, then try ignorance.

Posted by: Rémi Houle | 2006-10-15 12:49:30 PM


I just scroll over posts that have no paragraph breaks. Some people have no manners.

Alberta is so beautiful I would never consider living in another province, especially not the racist communist province of Quebec. To live among Quebecers who accept corruption as part of their culture would be unthinkable.

Yes, Remi, one day our non-renewable energy resources will be either gone, replaced by other fuels, or so common and cheap that the market will tank.

That's why Albertans are so ANGRY about the present and historic theft of our resource revenues. Ottawa has always erected barriers to the expansion of Alberta's economic base, a kind of East/West neo-Mercantilism, we have good reason to want to kick Canada out of Alberta.

I am sick and tired of hearing corrupt Easterners tell us what to do, who we are, or how to live.

Posted by: Speller | 2006-10-15 1:34:01 PM


Duke, you raise a good point about socialism: socialism is just like the white female (or the wife in general) who bashes men, tries to (sometimes successfully) manipulate the men in her life, blames the males around her for all the world's ills - and still eagerly lives off them, nonetheless. At its core, socialism (like feminism, Ottawa, and liberals) is parasitic and it eats its host and enervates its society.

Posted by: bk | 2006-10-15 1:55:32 PM


We don't need to suckle off Mama's teet any longer, so let's lop it off.

I think that about sums up the intellecual argument for Western seperatism.

By the way, with what army? It occurs to me, to paraphrase Paul Wells, that Albertans might feel a little differently when the tanks start to roll in.

Posted by: MK | 2006-10-15 2:21:43 PM


MK - Intellectual arguments are for intellectual idiots. They are the last ones to face anything never mind reality. There are more ways of killing a pig than kissing it to death and I for one would like to experiment.

Posted by: Western Canadian | 2006-10-15 3:05:39 PM


I apologize for my lack of spacing. It never occured to me that I was being rude.

Posted by: jema54j | 2006-10-15 3:07:07 PM


As far as I am concerned Alberta should of said "see yah" to canada when turdoh pulled the NEP out of his hat.

As for "what army" I volunteer for the Alberta Citizens Militia, anyone else?

Posted by: FREE | 2006-10-15 3:44:16 PM



If the 'tanks roll into Alberta' they will most likely be filled with westerners who will use the opportunity to visit the folks.

I do believe that the majority of recruitment is from the West as usual.

Re paragraphs ...

In music, the silence between the notes are just as important as the notes.

The same for the written words ... some effort at punctuation helps too.

Of course I am no one to talk about edited comments.

Posted by: Duke | 2006-10-15 4:07:18 PM


MK, while it occurs to many that the CF is stretched thin in Afghanistan, you might note that Canada is a lot bigger place to defend than Alberta is.

Mama was always stealing our milk money and starving us while blowing it on Bolshevik Bingo.

She tried to drown us in the bath tub and keeps sleep walking with a knife in her hand.

Posted by: Speller | 2006-10-15 4:13:44 PM


Um, Speller:

My dad's family first homesteaded in the Red River Valley in 1903. My mother's homesteaded in 1911 about two miles north of the farm I grew up on near Grande Prairie. First house I lived in, my great-grandparents had built by pushing two wooden granaries end to end. It had running water, but the bathroom was an outhouse in which my dad kept a propane torch to heat up the seat in 40-below weather. Depending on how I count it, I'm a fourth or fifth generation Albertan.

Even so, I don't have a chip on my shoulder about Ontario, and I've never felt the need to apologize for being an Albertan. And frankly, I find the whole Alberta insecurity schtick a little tired.

Alberta has arrived. "Get over it."
--
Russ

Posted by: Russ Kuykendall | 2006-10-15 4:14:01 PM


I'm not about to forgive nor forget Russ, get over it yourself Ontarian.

It's a lot easier to throw rocks at a boat tethered to shore when your standing on the shore and making your camp with the barbarians isn't it Russ?

We in the boat are still going to cut the ties that bind, I hope you like living in a land whose glory days are past and were paid for in stolen swag.

As an Albertan I am ever mindful of the slim minority government of Stephen Harper, how many of his cabinet Ministers are Eastern Progressives, and that NOTHING has been done to ensure that the rapacity of Eatern Canada never happens again.

We in Alberta have no more security than we did in 1980 or 1905 for that matter.

Posted by: Speller | 2006-10-15 4:23:46 PM



Believe nothing you hear and only half of what you see.

Then you might have chance to survive the bullshit.

Posted by: Duke | 2006-10-15 4:27:14 PM


Oh, and Russ, say howdy for me to that 'once upon a time' Calgary boy Warren Kinsella for me.

Posted by: Speller | 2006-10-15 4:41:48 PM


MK: If the tanks roll in, they will have been sent by a Lieberal govt., and we know they will be here to fix some dams or fight forest fires or rescue drowning boaters or some other "peacekeeping" type things. Not to worry.

Posted by: MarkAlta | 2006-10-15 5:00:43 PM


This is a money quote from a Mark Steyn interview with Linda Frum in the NP

“It starts in kindergarten. Every time you're faced with a situation where a grade school teacher is telling your child patent nonsense, you should object. Every Canadian is the heir to a thousand years of constitutional evolution from the one civilization that has done the most to create the world we live in. Canada has very little to be ashamed of in its inheritance. Every country needs a heroic national narrative. Canada has actually got one. Why not tell it?”

read the whole thing:
http://www.canada.com/nationalpost/news/story.html?id=0c2ff5bc-651d-4cac-a822-4a79b392fed1&p=3


It seems to me Alberta is in a position to add to the national "narrative" if it wants to.

Posted by: nomdenet | 2006-10-15 5:46:41 PM


Yes, nomdenet, a Maritimer like you should know that Alberta does want to add to the nation narrative.

Alberta wants to add the part about how even though all those proud Maritimers lived for 50 years off of Alberta's plundered resource revenues, Newfoundlanders finally struck oil, demanded 100% of the revenues AND put the strong arm on Prime Minister Stephen Harper to ensure that, although in the 2006 election Newfoundlanders gave FOUR seats to the OPENLY CORRUPT Liberals to the 3 they gave the CPC, The Premier of Newfoundland threatened that unless Alberta oil revenues continued to flow into his governments coffers that there would be no support for Harpers government coming next election.
http://calsun.canoe.ca/News/National/2006/10/15/2032479-sun.html

The part that Alberta adds to the Canadian narrative, not that we ever added anything but money before eh, is where Albertan's realize that the crass sentimentality that they have for the Canadian hoax is too costly for future generations of Albertans and decides to end the abusive relationship with Canaduh.

Posted by: Speller | 2006-10-15 6:21:43 PM


If the Liberals send in those 40 year old tanks manned by newfies (the largest component of recruits), Canada will have lost a war without a shot fired. Every Albertan will forever be changed to oppose Canada in every way available to them (i.e. tax evasion, gun evasion, law evasion etc...wait!!! that already happening!!!) The reaction to the FLQ crisis by Quebecers will pale in comparison to an Albertan response. I hope the tanks do roll in!

Posted by: "Biff"Henderson | 2006-10-15 7:24:06 PM


Speller, the good news is: I’m not a Maritimer … yet.

The bad news is: I’m from downtown Toronto amongst the Volvo driving, latté sucking, zero Conservative MP electing, utopians.

It gets worse .. I grew up in Quebec and voted for Trudeau first time out (for which I’ve been officially atoned by Mark Steyn). So I guess that mugged by reality journey makes me a neo-con.

I’m sort of a conservative fifth column in a Trojan Horse (I know you’ll say the back part of the horse).

PS,
I do agree with you that Danny Williams has messed up with oil. He made his money, lots of it, on the cable TV business … government regulated .. very different from nervous oil capital. But they love him down there just like Canadians love it when our Liberal PMs give Washington the hi-sign.

Posted by: nomdenet | 2006-10-15 9:27:59 PM


Russ

You have cast doubt on the strength of Alberta's sepratist aspirations before, telling your readers of your roots in rural Alberta, and not seeing any change in attitude since you have left.

I dissaree. We are all watching to see how sucessful Harper will be in lessening Ottawa's influence in our lives. If he fails the kettle will boil over.

It is not a matter of Alberta demanding a greater role in the nations business. We have tried before. The changes that you suggest could occur will simply take too long. We are tired of waiting.

The Ontario/Quebec powerbrokers will never allow this to happen.

The Republic Of Alberta/Western Canada is a sure thing. All that is lacking is a credible leader.

Posted by: Bazoo | 2006-10-15 11:19:21 PM


Think we could borrow those 60 Challenger battle tanks the Brits have at CFB Suffield.

All less than 5 - 6 years old, lots of spare parts, and uhmm.......lots of ammo 3kms down the Jenner highway.

Tell the Brits they can use Suffield free for the next 20 years, they might even drive them for us.

Posted by: Mike D | 2006-10-15 11:59:50 PM


Baz

If PMSH should lose the next election in Kanuckistan he may just be the right man to lead Alberta/the West out of Egypt and into the light.

Well one could hope!

Posted by: Simon | 2006-10-16 7:02:34 AM


Dont be fooled people.
Quebec has the economic power to get out of Canada any days now. Even PM Charest had to admit it publictly in an interview in France.
Plus, dont think Quebecers wont separates just because of economic reasons, This is underestimating Quebecers values and this may "cost U". We have eared the same shit every time we've tried a referedum and still, we've took our chances. Corporations and business will get out but others will come in...
Nondenet, I have a good news for you and the Quebekistan theorie promoters: Quebec birth rate for 2006 was 80 000 and still counting. And pleeeeease stop thinking the ROC is our "gardian".lol.
As we say in Quebec: We still having the same distinc culture after 400 years of been "surounding" by the ROC: And you're thinking that 100 Mok Mok will drive us ??? hahahaha....who have a sense of overblown self esteem now ?? Funny Albertanians :-)

The reality about Babyboomers growing older in Quebec is a real problem but we will face it and find some solutions. We,re aware of this reality since many years and there's have been plans put on the table to resolve this thing.

As for an association Alberta/Quebec: Forget about it. Harper is still angry about PM Charest public statments on Kyoto, Culture investment in Quebec that force him to do so in Ottawa, and Guns registration...
Our values are too different yours (alberta) and yours too different than ours. Let's face it.

If we dont promote the next referendum on the "language thing" but more on a "divergence d'opinions" with the West and a CPC, well...our dream (the one many of you also wish for) will come true!

Have a nice week people!

Posted by: Marc | 2006-10-16 9:08:11 AM


"Quebec has the economic power to get out of Canada any days now."

Whatever. Quebec is not going anywhere and everyone knows it, including the separatists.

If they haven't done it by now, and the clock's been running for 40 years, they're never going to do it.

But if I'm wrong, could that any day be tomorrow? Please?

Posted by: Kathryn | 2006-10-16 9:53:01 AM


Soon enought Kat...soon enought.
We've learn from the past and today's reality is giving us the tool that was missing previously
;-)

Posted by: Marc | 2006-10-16 10:10:42 AM


Once the James Bay natives separate from Quebec and decide they want to stay with Canada ... the area being granted by Canada to be held in trust for mere administrative purposes, how can Quebec's economy function without the use of force?

Quebec already is ‘more equal' than any other province in Canada.

To rebalance the federation, all provinces will be accorded the provincial rights Quebec already enjoys through a process of decentralization.

I will repeat ... you continue to demonstrate an overblown sense of self-esteem ... and if you can reinforce your dreams without resorting to killing innocents, please shed some light on the plan.

If Quebec claims the right to separate from Canada, then so do the James Bay natives.

Posted by: Set you free | 2006-10-16 10:20:54 AM


Set,
Ever eard of "La Paix des Braves" ?
An exemple for the ROC vs their natives.
Native from the James Baie are receiving 4.5 billions from Quebec.
Killing innoncents ? This has and never will be our style. We're the Anti "remember"...?

Posted by: Marc | 2006-10-16 10:33:46 AM


Set,
Ever eard of "La Paix des Braves" ?
An exemple for the ROC vs their natives.
Native from the James Baie are receiving 4.5 billions from Quebec.
Killing innoncents ? This has and never will be our style. We're the "Anti" remember...?

Posted by: Marc | 2006-10-16 10:35:03 AM


I'll be watching with interest.

Posted by: Set you free | 2006-10-16 10:53:10 AM


I'll do the same with Alberta.

Posted by: Marc | 2006-10-16 10:59:31 AM


That's good, my friend.

I just hope Alberta's next premier will be strong enough to escape Ottawa's yoke by reclaiming the same provincial rights Quebec now enjoys.

And, to rebalance the federation with an equal treatment of all provinces through the representation by population question.

Posted by: Set you free | 2006-10-16 11:22:28 AM


A sure thing: Harper will also help you doing that just like previous PM helped Quebec (not always for the better, but still)...

Posted by: Marc | 2006-10-16 11:34:32 AM


@ Western Canadian,
Hey man, here's the link:
https://secure.bloc.org/formulaires/secure/
We can send you a receipt if you ask...

Posted by: Marc | 2006-10-16 12:32:53 PM


Québec and Alberta actually have a great deal in common. Both economies are resource-based and both provinces resent Ontario's manufacturing clout. Both could survive separation from Canada provided they entered into some sort of economic pact with the U.S. in order to maintain markets and close financial ties.

That said, is there any way at all that we can discuss Canada's renewal and reinvigoration without invoking separation?

Québec won't separate, nor will Alberta; political separation is a game of "chicken" and neither province is willing to cross the line.

Posted by: John Palubiski | 2006-10-16 1:02:49 PM


Well John,
Half the Quebecers are willing...
The "kids" here are the one pushing the harder on the thing...
I'm telling you man, I'm pretty confident we're ready for the next one.
Sad thing that Albertanors and Quebecers dont get along on the base of human values.

Posted by: Marc | 2006-10-16 1:17:28 PM


Thats the rub John. There will never be a reinvigoration or renewal as long as Ontario and Quebec hold all of the cards. The separatist sentiment is real,not a game of chicken. Someone living in Ontario or Quebec should not have any say in the business of Albertans. (Canadian Wheat Board / Firearms Laws / Kyoto etc) This country is too diverse in culture and tradition to govern as it exists. I see no willingness from the east to change this any time soon.

Posted by: Bazoo | 2006-10-16 1:19:36 PM


Marc:

Albertans believe in inherent natural rights; Quebeckers seem to believe in man-made rights ... given the difference, I would rather live in Alberta where we know we are born free and we do not need courts to define our ‘rights,' which really are not rights at all.

Posted by: Set you free | 2006-10-16 1:25:45 PM



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