The Shotgun Blog
Saturday, July 22, 2006
Hezbollah can't tolerate a difference in "opinion"
As Israel continues to pummel Hezbollah, the terrorists are demanding negotiations. It'll be interesting to witness those sorts of negotiations, should they occur. I say that because Hezbollah is populated with the sort of people who can't imagine that they are wrong. There is no room for compromise. They can't even tolerate that other people don't believe in the things they do.
That attitude is displayed on the Hezbollah website.
Voice of America posted a story about the limits of free speech, discussing the issue of the Muhammad cartoons. In this piece, the author considers that Western societies have long limited free speech. Indeed, the piece is somewhat sympathetic to Muslims who wonder why free speech is not limited to protect their Prophet as it is in other contexts. Consider Holocaust denial:
According to Robert Kahn, a professor at Brooklyn Law School who has written extensively about laws governing Holocaust denial, free speech in the West is not an absolute right. It is tempered, Kahn says, by a complex system of legal and self-imposed censorship that's almost always derived from a society's history.
"The countries that tend to have the laws that specifically ban Holocaust denial -- France, Germany, and Austria --- either participated in the Holocaust or had serious problems with collaboration," he says. "Even though the United States and Canada have large Jewish communities, and have survivors and people who experienced the Holocaust, it's not the same type of thing."
This article was reprinted on the Hezbollah website, since it makes points that would please most Muslims. But here is the same excerpt:
According to Robert Kahn, a professor at Brooklyn Law School who has written extensively about laws governing Holocaust denial, free speech in the West is not an absolute right. It is tempered, Kahn says, by a complex system of legal and self-imposed censorship that`s almost always derived from a society`s history.
"The countries that tend to have the laws that specifically ban Holocaust denial -- France, Germany, and Austria --- either participated in the Holocaust or had serious problems with collaboration," he says. "Even though the United States and Canada have large Jewish communities, and have (alleged) survivors and people who (allegedly) experienced the Holocaust, it's not the same type of thing."
I checked. The article is otherwise faithfully reproduced.
Faithfully, except for the statement by Professor Kahn that the Holocaust happened, and that there were survivors. I guess you aren't free to say that in the presence of the Hezbollah.
The Holocaust allegedly happened, and there are alleged survivors. Anyone who says different is going to be corrected. Even without their permission.
Negotiations happen because people have differences of opinion, and are looking for some sort of modus vivendi. Negotiations require a level of honesty, of acknowledging the other side's position and looking for common ground. But with Hezbollah, it would appear that someone else's "opinion" is not to be tolerated. When everyone accepts Hezbollah's view of the world, negotiations can begin.
I think we're in for a long fight.
Posted by Steve Janke on July 22, 2006 | Permalink
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Every last member of the "Hezbolla Virus" must be killed by any means.
WE MUST STOP ALL MUSLIM IMMIGRATION INTO THE WEST NOW!
If we don't do this, we will stack the deck against freedom and our soft, obese, lazy, stuck-on-stupid citizenery will either pray to Allah or die.
Posted by: Duke | 2006-07-22 12:38:20 PM
islam is NOT a religion
it is a political judicial fascist system
in 1981 hbo did a great docuntary on nostradamus done by orson welles called " the man who saw tomorrow"
forget about whether or not these predictions in his quatrains were explained, but concrating on what the makers of that documentary said and what they determined his future predictions were as of that date in 1981. example - he said there would be a huge earthquake in the new city in 1988, a new city was vconsidered a city in the new world just discovered in the 1500s when he lived. well the san fran quake was in 1989. but then it goes further saying the muslim world with its growing population and he states 750 million then in 1981 in the world. well now 25 years later it is 1.1 BILLION. do you not see why all muslim families breed like rats? the documentary goes on to say the mohammedans and the persians will attack the western and the entire world lked by a persian leader- persia is iran i am sure you know. and a nuclear war will occur and we will win but suffer so much loss that IT MUST BE DONE NOW WHILE ONLY WE HAVE THE TECHNOLOGY AND BEFORE THE RATS BREED THEMSELVES INTO A MAJORITY EVERYWHERE THEY STOOK A FOOT IN OUR DOOR.
Get this video- cheap price and done in 1981 long before any of these things started happening or iran starting to threaten the world
several of them on ebay, heres one
Posted by: woodbridge | 2006-07-22 12:54:26 PM
ISLAM IS A TERMINAL DISEASE THAT NEEDS TO BE TERMINATED
Protesters rally in Australia, N.Z. against IDF action in Lebanon
By News Agencies
Protesters took to the streets of major Australian cities Saturday to call for a halt to Israel's attacks on Lebanon.
Across Indian-controlled Kashmir, businesses and schools were shut down Saturday in protest at Israel's continuing air strikes on southern Lebanon.
"We just want to give a message that peace is the only solution," said Keysar Trad, a prominent Muslim representative and organizer of a demonstration in Sydney that drew 10,000 people.
"It's just a terrible, terrible human catastrophe that's taken place because of the bombing. We have to do what we can to put an end to it."
Trad, the founder of the Islamic Friendship Association, said he had assured the 400 police on duty in the city centre that Saturday's march would be peaceful.
"We will not tolerate any violence, we will not tolerate any racism, we will not tolerate anything that does not serve the cause of peace," he said.
Amongst the crowd were toddlers wearing printed T-shirts with the slogan: "Stop killing the babies."
Former Guantanamo Bay detainee Mamdouh Habib was among those leading the march.
Last week Lebanese-born Trad was at the centre of controversy after accusing Australian Prime Minister John Howard's government of racism for not responding quickly enough to evacuate Australia citizens from Lebanon.
"This government is initiating racism here," Trad said. "There are signs of the federal government breeding racism."
He also accused the government of siding with Israel in the latest round of violence instigated by the Hezbollah militia in southern Lebanon.
"Our government is caught up in the constant blind support of the Israeli government," he said.
At a rally in Melbourne that drew 500 protesters, deputy chairman of the Australian Arabic Council (AAC) Taimor Hazou said Canberra had failed to put pressure on Israel to stop the bombardment.
"Our influence is insignificant," Hazou said. "Australia has done the bidding of Israel and the US, yet the impact and relevance of this relationship is negligible when it concerns Australians or Australian interests."
In Auckland, New Zealand, a man was arrested Saturday when he climbed on the roof of the United States Consulate and pulled down the American flag during a demonstration against Israel's bombing of Lebanon, news reports said.
About 200 protestors marched through the city, condemning comments
by U.S. Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice, who said Washington would
not support a cease-fire in the Middle East.
Another 100 people staged a demonstration without incident in the capital Wellington.
The Kashmir protest strike call was given by Syed Ali Shah Geelani who heads the hard-line faction of All Parties Hurriyat Conference, the region's main separatist alliance.
Jammu-Kashmir is the only Muslim-majority state in India, where more than 80 percent of the population is Hindu. Militants have been conducting an insurgency to wrest the region from Indian control since 1989. More than 66,000 people have died.
Angry protests were held in several parts of India on Friday against Israel's military action. Protests erupted soon after Muslim prayers Friday afternoon in Kashmir, the northern state of Uttar Pradesh, and Hyderabad, the capital of the southern Andhra Pradesh state - all areas with large Muslim populations.
Geelani, 76, was put under house arrest for the day, said an officer at the police control room, who spoke on condition of anonymity because he wasn't authorized to speak to the media.
Posted by: woodbridge | 2006-07-22 1:04:36 PM
Long fight Steve!!!???? Indeed my friend....we are in the 1400 year of this fight against Islam and it isn't going to end soon I'm afriad.....
Posted by: Albertanator | 2006-07-22 2:25:43 PM
C'mon now. Don't you know these guys are oppressed?
They are living in prisons of their own design, but hey, may as well blame somebody else for their misery.
Since Muslims are not allowed to listen to music because it may lead to a decadent lifetyle, they would not recognize the first phrase of the previous paragraph as something done by the Doors.
Instead, it's OK to behave like doorknobs ... lifelessly stand around while somebody twists your inner being.
It truly is sad that human beings would allow themselves to be manipulated in that way.
Posted by: Set you free | 2006-07-22 2:30:05 PM
Opinion? What's opinion?
There's only one way, the way of Allah.
And me being the only one allowed to be the arbiter of right and wrong, I don't like your opinion.
Off with your head!
Posted by: Set you free | 2006-07-22 2:37:39 PM
"Off with your head!"
or your hand
or your foot
or her clitoris
Posted by: woodbridge | 2006-07-22 3:05:46 PM
2 MORE(might be more) CANADIANS MURDERED BY MUSLIMS
Two Canadian soldiers dead
Eight injured in suicide bomb attack
Cpl. Jason Patrick Warren.
Photograph by : CP/HO
By Ethan Baron, CanWest News Service
Published: Saturday, July 22, 2006
KANDAHAR, Afghanistan — Celebration turned to grief for Canadian troops after a pair of suicide bombers killed two soldiers and wounded eight on Saturday, as their armoured convoy neared its home base at the end of a major phase of combat operations.
The first blast, from a vehicle laden with explosives, killed Cpl. Francisco Gomez, 44, an anti-armour specialist from the Princess Patricia's Canadian Light Infantry in Edmonton, who was driving the Bison armoured vehicle targeted by the bomber's vehicle. Cpl. Jason Patrick Warren, 29, of the Black Watch in Montreal was also killed.
One injured soldier, assessed to be in good condition with non-life-threatening injuries, was flown to a military hospital in Germany, for treatment not available in Afghanistan. Two wounded soldiers were kept in hospital for observation, and five were released from hospital Saturday night and are expected to return to duties shortly. The soldiers were part of a returning convoy of Canadian soldiers who were destined to return to Canada within weeks, their tour of duty in Afghanistan complete.
All told, 19 Canadian soldiers and one Canadian diplomat have been killed while on duty in Afghanistan since the Canadian forces were deployed there in 2002 to fight Taliban forces.
Posted by: woodbridge | 2006-07-22 5:45:13 PM
woodbridge: no no no! They weren't killed in action fighting the Taliban.
If you look at the Gloat and Wail's comment section, they were killed by George W. Bush and Dick Cheney in their corporate war in Afghanistan!
Uh yeah right. But I am shocked at how deep such opinions run in Ontario. All they have are hoaxes and conspiracy theories - proves that Ontario has way more money than brains.
Posted by: Scott | 2006-07-22 5:52:55 PM
Islam is a cancer.Saying they are a religion of peace is akin to the liberals being a party of principles.Unfortunately it will take another 9/11 for this country to wake up.I would like our government to pass a law making it illegal to be in public with your face covered. Simple and effective.
Posted by: wallyj | 2006-07-22 6:26:54 PM
So it would be illegal for somebody to cover their face in shame?
Posted by: Set you free | 2006-07-22 6:52:37 PM
Great comments. People are getting real. I think it is time to think of an organization to meet our goals. And see some action towards our goals.
Posted by: Rémi Houle | 2006-07-22 8:52:53 PM
Mohammed was a truce breaker.
The Islamic doctrine of Taqiyya permits lying in defense of Islam and Muslims.
We should not let Hizb'allah have a HUDNA.
HUDNA(who'-d-nah) - Arabic word often translated as "cease-fire.- Historically used as a tactic aimed at allowing the party declaring the hudna to regroup while tricking an enemy into lowering its guard. When the hudna expires, the party that declared it is stronger and the enemy weaker. The term comes from the story of the Muslim conquest of Mecca. Instead of a rapid victory, Muhammad made a ten-year treaty with the Kuraysh tribe. In 628 AD, after only two years of the ten-year treaty, Muhammad and his forces concluded that the Kuraysh were too weak to resist. The Muslims broke the treaty and took over all of Mecca without opposition.
Posted by: Speller | 2006-07-22 11:16:30 PM
Wallyj and SYF:
There must be a few cities in Canada that already have a by-law that makes it an offense to be "masked" or disuised in public. The town I grew up in had one. But even if Canada were to amend the criminal code and make it illegal to wear masks or disguises (trying to get rid of burqas here...)would it be applicable? Our courts have a history of ruling in favour of so-called religious freedoms as guaranteed by the Charter of Rights. Example: Sikhs are allowed to carry a weapon (kirpan) to school. I wonder how I would feel as a bank teller, if I saw a person walk into the bank wearing a sack over her (or is it his?) head... What else is the person carrying under that thing?
Posted by: Nothing New Under the Sun | 2006-07-23 12:45:06 AM
Sunday, July 23, 2006
Our very strange day with Hezbollah
Hezbollah invited us to come see them again; it's the second time in as many days. Yesterday, Anderson, photographer Neil Hallsworth and I drove to the southern suburbs of Beirut and waited at a predetermined meeting spot.
A few minutes passed, then an old, American-made sedan pulled up behind us. Two men jumped out of the car. Our fixer approached them and after an animated conversation, one of the Hezbollah men stuck his head in our car window and said in passable English, "We're very sorry to inconvenience you but there will be no tour today. There are Israeli drones overhead and it's not safe to be here. Please leave now." Those were easy orders to follow.
Today, we were told Hezbollah was again willing to take our team into their neighborhood. Meet them at the same spot, they said, at 11 a.m. and don't be late. We weren't. We waited. Then waited some more, and what follows is a log of a very strange day with Hezbollah.
10:40 a.m.: Our team of Anderson, Neil, producer Tommy Evans and I arrive at the site of a bridge that's been blown to pieces by Israeli bombs. It's the same spot we met our Hezbollah men yesterday. Next to the bridge there are two high-rise apartment buildings under construction. This is a poor neighborhood and new construction clearly doesn't come here often. The buildings are heavily damaged, though, and it seems unlikely they'll ever be completed.
10:50 a.m.: Our translator, Mira, is making a call to Hezbollah's office, making sure they know we've arrived. You don't have to spend much time in these neighborhoods to realize that you're an outsider ... and you're being watched. They tell us they know we're here.
11:05 a.m.: Hezbollah is late for our meeting. We're sitting still for 25 minutes in an area recently hit hard by Israeli jets, so it's no surprise the mood is tense. We're not talking much. A young couple passes by -- the boy is wearing jeans and short sleeves, the girl a head-scarf and a dress covering her body ankle to wrist. They nod politely and continue past us. They're holding hands. We're still waiting.
11:22 a.m.: A crowd of journalists is passing 200 yards behind us and we quickly realize we've been given bad information and that Hezbollah's tour has started without us. We turn our car around and try to catch up.
11:26 a.m.: It's not hard to spot 40 western journalists walking through a bombed-out area, and we've just now found the group. We also find out we missed some ground rules. We're pulling into a side street and two men dressed in black step out of a doorway with AK-47s. Neil has the camera on his shoulder and they immediately assume he's rolling. He's not, but they want to check the tape anyway. We show it to them and they let us pass. Hezbollah tour ground rule #1: Don't show the faces of anyone we don't want you to see or pictures of places you're not supposed to be. Now we know. We catch up to the group.
11:35 a.m.: We're standing on what used to be a residential street. It's now a mess of wires and rubble. Smoke is still rising off the debris. Bombs have smashed nearly a quarter mile of this area and there's virtually nothing left. There's a twisted tire from a children's bike here, some compact disks from someone's collection there. Anderson is doing a few stand-ups, but the Hezbollah representative leading the tour is telling us it's time to move on. We tell him we want to talk to some people who lived here, who witnessed what happened. "Not here," he says. "Maybe at our next stop."
12:05 p.m.: Our car is being led through back streets to a broken-down building with five ambulances parked in front. "These are the emergency workers who respond to casualty calls when Israel drops their bombs," the Hezbollah man says. "Take your pictures and talk to some of them if you'd like." We're growing tired of what is now obviously a dog-and-pony show, but we decide to play along, and approach one driver with a few questions. Anderson asks him what kind of casualties he's seeing, but before he can answer, the ambulance beside us turns on his siren and screeches out, followed by the next ambulance, then the next. It's a well coordinated and not-so-subtle piece of propaganda that might as well come with a soundtrack titled "Hezbollah Cares."
12:16 p.m.: We again ask the Hezbollah guy (he won't give us his name) when we can talk to some residents, but he brushes us off and tells us maybe at our next stop. He's now on his cell phone and it's not hard to imagine he's making sure all the props are in place before we move on. I wish I spoke Arabic. He opens our car door, slides in, and says he's riding with us. We're fine with it and offer him a bottle of water. "No thank you," he says in English. While we have his attention, Anderson asks him if we can talk to someone in Hezbollah's leadership. His answer is short: "Not while we're at war." He gets out of our car and onto the back of someone's motor scooter.
12:30 p.m.: We're now driving through a neighborhood that hasn't seen any bombing, but it's here we're told we can talk to some residents. Hezbollah guy takes us down to what amounts to a crude bomb shelter and tells us the people here live on this street but are afraid to sleep in their apartment. The concrete room is dimly lit and dank. Two people on plastic chairs are watching an Arabic news channel. One sits in the corner yelling angry epithets about Israel for the reporters. We wait for the media gaggle to leave, then introduce ourselves. They tell us they're a mother, her son and his wife. There's no way to know if it's true. The conversation follows a familiar pattern:
"Are you scared?"
"Will you fight?"
"To the death!"
"Do you hate Israel?"
"Of course, and its mother America!"
We thank them for their insights and move back up to the street.
12:44 p.m.: We're back on the street and on cue, a Hezbollah resistance song is now blaring from an apartment. A young man on the porch dressed in black is giving us the victory sign. I look behind me and there's our Hezbollah guide encouraging the young man to lift his hands higher so our camera can see.
12:50 p.m.: Anderson is doing a few more stand-ups about our story that's quickly become less about Hezbollah and more about their crude propaganda machine when the "family" emerges from the bunker behind us and joins their friends in the street. They're laughing, talking loudly, and gesturing with their hands, mocking anger. I really should learn Arabic. Anderson does another stand-up about the group now standing behind us.
12:55 p.m.: We pile into our van and are now driving out of the Hezbollah-controlled neighborhood. It feels like we've just left a haunted house: Slightly frightening at first, but ridiculous by the end.
Posted By Charlie Moore, CNN Senior Producer: 11:11 AM ET
Posted by: woodbridge | 2006-07-23 3:54:26 PM
It's interesting to compare Hezbollah's position with that of the State of Israel vis-a-vis the Armenian Holocaust.
"Israel has declared that there was no change in its policy over the so-called Armenian genocide, reaffirming that it still sticks to what was expressed in 1995 that the topic should be discussed among historians, not politicians.
Drawing attention to Turkey's help to the Jews throughout history, an Israeli diplomat said that Israelis were aware of Turkey's support for Jews both before and during the Holocaust."
Now there's a novel solution. Let historians not politicians settle the issue.
Turkey's help to the Jews throughout history...? What power do the Turks hold over Israel? Possible revelations about the Donmeh, the Young Turks and the Armenian Holocaust?
Posted by: DJ | 2006-07-23 10:43:41 PM
Your analysis of Hudna is correct. Words, they use, and what they mean, simply do not translate without great explainations. Arafat said, when asked, that of course he would lie to the infidels; after all, he has killed so many!
Posted by: Lady | 2006-07-24 2:03:29 PM
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