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Monday, June 06, 2005
International Man of Mystery
Apparently Gurmant Grewal is taking this secret agent stuff a little too far.
Posted by Kevin Libin on June 6, 2005 | Permalink
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Comments
It doesn't make any sense. I'm cynical; I think it's part of the Librano$ propaganda.
Grewal doesn't need a passenger to take a package to Ottawa. This isn't the desert. It can be sent by Purolator.
I think it's just part of the agenda. Think what the Liberals have done with the tapes. They have alleged that they have been tampered with; the fact is - that this tampering does not negate the actual content of Murphy's offer. But, the Liberals are now saying that they cannot answer any questions about the tapes/offers, because the tapes have been 'tampered with'. This tampering might be irrelevant, and again, it doesn't negate those actual statements by Dosanjh and Murphy.
But- the Liberals have removed themselves from accountability.
Just like they've removed themselves from accountability with the no-confidence vote.
And Adscam.
And Somalia.
And Darfur.
And BMD.
And Iraq.
And other financial scams, by refusing to permit them to be audited.
And SSM - which they say is 'dictated' by the Charter.
Canada is not a democracy.
Posted by: ET | 2005-06-06 5:49:08 PM
My god, can ANYTHING, happen without ET calling it "Liberal Propaganda"?
What has Grewal ever done to make anyone believe that he is, in any way, credible?
If you want to take the Liberals to task for their record, please do it based on the record. When you take everything as a jumping off point to criticize them - even totally unrealted issues - it tends to dilute your argument.
Posted by: bob | 2005-06-06 5:52:43 PM
The problem, Bob, is that I am unaware of anything that the Liberals do, that is not geared strictly to the maintenance of themselves in power.
I would appreciate your enlightening me on the specific nature of their positive points.
Posted by: ET | 2005-06-06 6:00:23 PM
I'm not advocating that you support the Liberals, I'm advocating that you be intellectually mature enough to criticize them for things they actually do (of which there is more than enough for you to draw upon), rather than hysterically blame the Liberals for everything - including reports that Grewal has stuck his foot in it *again*.
Do you honestly believe that Air Canada is making this up as part of a Liberal plot? Is Grewal really the guy you want to go to bat for? Please.
It is hard to take you seriously when you constantly cite this sort of nonsense as "Liberal Propaganda". As I said, there are plenty of things to criticize without having to make things up.
Posted by: bob | 2005-06-06 6:14:36 PM
Well, Bob, let's wait and see. I appreciate your comments and you DO have a point.
My post pointed out that the data provided to us - that Grewal was trying to get AC passengers to take a parcel to Ottawa was so 'far out' as to be unbelievable. I broke it down into several 'probabilities'. Did he do it, and if so - why?
(1)A parcel could be sent by Purolator. Why didn't he do this? Oh..perhaps it could be lost?!
(2)Yes, but, sending a parcel with an unknown individual would be even more risky!
(3)I move on to the next probability. That the data is false.
I can't think of any probabilities other than those three.
Posted by: ET | 2005-06-06 6:35:00 PM
According to a reporter on Duffy tonight it was an envelope with the original tapes in it he wanted sent to Ottawa. He did find someone to take them if I heard correctly and then went to the Air Canada desk and postponed his flight till Sunday. My take on it is that the guy doesnt know you are not supposed to ask other people to take things on an aircraft. So whether he is stupid or naive is hard to say. Probably a bit of both. It seems to me though that this incident will be made to look worse than it actually is, and I would agree with ET that certainly the Liberals will use it for propaganda purposes. Wouldnt you Bob??
Posted by: MikeP | 2005-06-06 7:06:52 PM
c'mon... how can you make that kind of thing up?
EXTRAORDINARY spin doctoring, in that case.
you're almost flattering the libs.
Posted by: May Strimeedya | 2005-06-06 7:08:02 PM
Well May I am basically passing on what I saw and heard on tv. It would be unusual to say the least for someone on Duffy to make light of it. At least that was my take on it. But go to CTV.ca and let us know what you think. I am certainly not trying to spin, just making an observation.
Posted by: MikeP | 2005-06-06 7:18:30 PM
Did I read correctly a couple of days ago that Grewal was going to be taking English classes?
(I know a woman who used to do this to ship her dogs - go to Air Canada and ask passengers to take them as excess baggage for a fraction of the normal cargo fee).
Posted by: Kate | 2005-06-06 8:05:18 PM
But what doesn't make sense, is to ask a perfect stranger to deliver a valuable item to someone.
That's what doesn't make sense. As an MP, he has the funds for secure and special delivery services. He doesn't have to rely on asking a stranger to be his carrier boy.
Kate- the woman who shipped her dogs was doing it, as you say, to save fees.
Grewal doesn't have that financial consideration.
My understanding was that the original tapes had been handed over to the RCMP. The tapes the G&M and the Liberals and etc were frothing about, were copies.
Now, we hear that Grewal still has the original tapes, and asked complete and utter strangers to deliver them?????
Remember, he doesn't have any financial considerations to worry about; both his MP funds and the CPC would look after those tapes. I'm sorry - the scenario is too bizarre to be believed.
As for Mike Duffy, as long as he can make the Liberals look good and others look bad - that's fine. His show, in my view, is nothing but pure Liberal propaganda. Sorry Bob - but that's my view.
Posted by: ET | 2005-06-06 8:15:51 PM
In his criticism of ET Bob misses the point. That point is, for Bob's benefit, the people who are behind the Liberal Party, are also behind the MSM. You can't believe anything the MSM says in this country anymore, or in the US either for that matter. So yes, it is very easy to blame the Liberals these days. They've earned it and they deserve it.
And I thought the RCMP were looking at those "original tapes" already. No? If not, and they wanted them, then they would ask a mountie from the Lower Mainland to pick them up in person wouldn't they? It's hard to know who to believe anymore. But then that was another MSM reporter talking I guess.
Posted by: John Crittenden | 2005-06-06 8:19:27 PM
ET this site has the best explanation for the airport incident.
http://nomoresocialism.blogspot.com/
Posted by: MikeP | 2005-06-06 8:23:14 PM
I'm confused>>>> it was Tiny Tim and Dosanjh who have been proven to openly pimp for floor crossers and it's Grewal theat gets all the stress????
Something's inverse from realities here. Are we seeing a camp rendition of classic comic Bizzaro world of have the Liberals become unrepentant of being caught in open bribery and sleaze
Posted by: WLMackenzie redux | 2005-06-06 8:33:37 PM
Family Revolt Within Liberals
Josh Pringle
Monday, June 6, 2005
Pat O'Brien's divorce from the Liberal Party is triggering a family revolt within the caucus.
A Toronto Liberal M-P says several colleagues are considering voting against their government's budget in order to kill the same-sex marriage bill.
Jim Karygiannis says at least three Liberals have suggested they could vote against the budget.
The House of Commons is expected to vote on the federal Liberals budget next week.
Karygiannis says they're considering the drastic move as a way of killing the same-sex marriage legislation by toppling the minority government.
O'Brien says he'll sit as an Independent and will do whatever it takes to destroy the same-sex marriage bill.
cfra.com
Posted by: maz2 | 2005-06-06 9:13:40 PM
I gather that CBC news just did a hatchet job on Grewal - based on the hysterical "Didja hear what Grewal did? He just broke the law!" I got from my wife. No, they're not very scared of a Conservative majority.
Posted by: Justzumgai | 2005-06-06 9:15:04 PM
Thanks, MikeP, for the blog site. I think that explanation is equally bizarre. I'm - well, I don't believe anything anymore.
What IS the truth is that the Liberals are no longer bound by any rules, any morality, any ideals. They have one and only one agenda: to remain in power.
The Liberals have slithered out of accountability for the tapes by saying that the 'tapes were altered', conveniently ignoring that what is ON the tapes and what was obviously not altered (Murphy's voice, Dosanjh's voice)..is completely incriminating. Two senior Liberal officials attempt to bribe a vote. The Liberals are refusing to answer questions, using a red herring tactic.
The originals of the tapes, we were told by Harper, were with the RCMP. So- what was Grewal doing?
What's next on the agenda for the Liberals, after moving themselves out of accountability for what their senior officials did? Destroy Grewal. He betrayed them. They can't, for obvious reasons, fling him, attached to a concrete block, into the Ottawa River. So- they'll destroy him this way.
I still refuse to accept that Grewal was sending the originals of the tapes to Ottawa, via a complete and utter stranger. Dear god, any such person could sell them to CTV for a zillion bucks. And CTV would splice and dice them.
But- back to reality. I cannot believe that Grewal was asking strangers to deliver anything, tapes or candy floss, to authorities in Ottawa.
He has the means to get them there by Purolator. The CPC has the means; it can even have some individual, a party member, take that flight instead of Grewal. Grewal doesn't have to go begging the passengers to do him a favour.
So- I can't see this scene; it's beyond belief.
BUT- what is not beyond belief, is that the Liberal machine would seek to destroy Grewal for his 'betrayal'. It is a powerful machine, for as I've said umpteen times, the Liberals control all non-elected authority in this country - and that's a lot of authority.
Grewal obviously did something at the airport. I suspect it had nothing to do with the tapes or with the CPC. I suspect that the authorities in Air Canada were informed, and the spin started..
Why doesn't Grewal tell us exactly what he did?
By the way, the Liberals apparently are not in the least shy about using blackmail against people. I suspect that they are doing that with Layton (I'm referring to a post on Kate's SDA site).
Posted by: ET | 2005-06-06 9:21:19 PM
You are right ET who knows what to believe anymore?? Someone on Duffy said it was tapes but no one really knows. I hope that the liberal same sex marriage revolt becomes the undoing of the liberals because somewere along the line an end has to come to this charade.
Posted by: MikeP | 2005-06-06 9:34:06 PM
It was recommended that I post my theory(ish):
I think "trivial" is the proper term...
Something stinks here. It seems that Mr. Grewal was seen trying to get a package from Vancouver to Ottawa on an airplane based on this story. Here's what we know for sure:
- Mr. Grewal is the individual that busted the Liberal government trying to bribe him, as an MP, to abstain from a critical vote.
- The airline in question is Air Canada.
- Air Canada is a pet of the liberal government.
- No one knows the contents of the package or who was to receive it.
- There is only speculation as to why the package needed to be at it's destination within hours as opposed to "over night" as would have been provided by a courier.
Conclusion: Some of the liberal minions at Air Canada thought it would be advantageous to leak a non-story about the individual that caught their leaders red-handed at their dirty games.
This is instructive. It tells us that a), the average socialist worker (Air Canada union employee) doesn't understand the depth of their master's corruption and, b) the Liberals are on the ropes if this is the best they can come up with.
Posted by: Richard Evans | 2005-06-06 9:40:37 PM
the "X-files" theme is playing in the background... NealNews is running the headline: "Man dies after going berserk at Ottawa airport..." Now, the big question is this: Was that man carrying Grewal's secret package?
ROFLMAO GodDamnIt, where's one of those moonbat tin-foil hats when you need one?
Posted by: Richard Evans | 2005-06-06 10:18:47 PM
Maybe, just maybe, some posters might want to consider the possibility that Grewal f***ed up badly and has been caught. I believe that he should be suspended from the CPC caucus immediately and the CPC should openly and honestly conduct its own investigation, perhaps through independent investigators, into this matter.
Whether or not the whole event has turned into Liberal spin at its very best, which may be the case, is beyond the point. If that is the way the game is played in this country, you have to recognize that and either change the rules of the game (over time as the Republicans successfully did starting with Reagan) or learn to win within the existing rules. But reflexively blaming the media and Liberal spin, while convenient, is lazy and won't solve any problems. And if the CPC can't figure that out, we will be doomed to another Liberal government.
The simple fact of the matter is that right of centre politicians must have a higher standard of ethics and must have better control of their actions and their words than those on the left. This fact won't change any time soon. The CPC needs to continue to focus on Liberal misdeeds but also must deliver a positive message of change, both in how government and Parliament should work. This would include implementing a number of checks and balances since the conventions and norms that the Westminster system relies on can no longer be depended upon. But, more importantly, the CPC needs to talk about how Canada would be better if they governed it. Lower taxes while protecting key social programs. A strong and principled foreign policy, backed by a stronger military. Better, more effective social programs. Pride in Canada and what in can be.
The longer the CPC and its supporters only bitch about poor treatment, etc., the longer it will be until they govern.
Of course, that's just my opinion. I could be wrong.
Posted by: Strong and Free in AB | 2005-06-07 7:40:26 AM
I wasn't mentioning the pet incident as an explanation - just a recollection that it's not that uncommon (or wasn't in pre-9/11 days).
Something else does smell here, as in - who in Air Canada mentioned an internal investigation to the media and why? And would there be one at all if it weren't Grewal?
Posted by: Kate | 2005-06-07 7:54:03 AM
Strong and Free in AB; you make a lot of good points but I don't think it's simply a question of ethics. There's more to it...Ah..yes, Kate...who in Air Canada spoke to the Press????
We don't know what Grewal did, so, I'm not sure if he should be suspended. I trust Harper's integrity.
What puzzles me beyond anything..is what actually happened.
Surely Grewal can't be so dumb as to try to get a complete stranger to transport 'vital documents' to Ottawa. If Grewal had the wits to tape his meetings with Murphy, that suggests that he can 'imagize' the lack of integrity. So, shouldn't he equally consider that whoever he gave that package to...might have no integrity..and wouldn't deliver it or inform the media or.....????
That's what bothers me. I can't come up with any explanation.
1) We were told the RCMP already had the original tapes. So, how can these be the original tapes? What was in the package - if there was one -? Tapes? Extra tapes?
2)Again, I can't fathom anyone entrusting tapes or .. to a complete stranger. It's beyond my weak understanding.
3)Money is not an issue here; even a carrier is not an issue. The CPC could readily have asked someone to make the trip. But instead - to rely on a complete stranger???
As for the CPC being 'better' than the Liberals, I wonder if that matters. We are now trapped within a 'Cave' of constant propaganda. It is very difficult for the CPC - and us - to be heard. I don't think it's up to the CPC for even if they show that they have more integrity than the Liberals - the propaganda controlled by the Liberals - will spin that integrity into its opposite. Think of the adjectives: controlling, repressive, inhibiting freedom of expression, etc.
I think it's up to the average common citizen - and blogs - to express more and more voices of dissent.
Posted by: ET | 2005-06-07 8:42:25 AM
It's a strange story all around, and Grewal hasn't thrown any light on the situation. What are the benefits to him of having someone carry the package to Ottawa when he could just hire a courier?
People have been generally cynical of Harper's decision to put Grewal on sick leave. But Grewal's actions seem to paint him as a man who is under intense pressure and is behaving irrationally because of it.
Of course, this won't matter to the vultures currently pursuing him.
Posted by: Peter | 2005-06-07 4:04:44 PM
I must disagree.
I remember how kind and considerate the national media were is their coverage of that perverted jewl thief Svend Robinson, who was under so much stress due to ... due to ... well, something or other.
I see no reason why a Conservative MP would be treated any differently.
Posted by: Brian O'Neill | 2005-06-07 4:09:12 PM
OOPS
A few mistakes:
1) Should have been, "...were in their coverage of that perverted jewel thief..."
2) Of course they'll treat Grewal as a complete and utter loon.
Posted by: Brian O'Neill | 2005-06-07 4:10:56 PM
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